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#98164 - 05/17/08 04:07 PM
VBC pay rate per line
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TJill
Junior Member
Registered: 04/03/08
Posts: 26
Loc: New York, NY
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Saw this on mtjobs.com. Here is the compensation one company is offering:
Compensation Information: DOE and test results; 0.08-0.09 per 55-black-character line; employee status.
Would you consider this viable compensation?
TY!
_________________________
TJill
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#98165 - 05/17/08 04:34 PM
Re: VBC pay rate per line
[Re: TJill]
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Julie W8
Member
Registered: 01/10/99
Posts: 3475
Loc: Los Angeles, CA USA
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Depends on how many lines you type an hour but since they've shortened the line to 55 characters and the pay rate is comparable to 65-character line rates with spaces, I'd say it probably comes out to about the same.
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#98184 - 05/17/08 06:27 PM
Re: VBC pay rate per line
[Re: Julie W8]
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14tonks
Member
Registered: 10/25/01
Posts: 5931
Loc: Only 3rd world country in US
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A 55-character VBC line has always counted virtually identically to 65-character-and-space lines counted on the same documents when I've tested, and these days I think 8 to 9 cpl is considered quite decent employee pay, particularly if the job comes with any bennies.
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#98294 - 05/19/08 08:54 PM
Re: VBC pay rate per line
[Re: 14tonks]
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TJill
Junior Member
Registered: 04/03/08
Posts: 26
Loc: New York, NY
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TY very much, Julie w8 and 14tonks. Like many people, I am suspicious of the VBC as just another way to cut compensation by cutting out pay for keying spaces for MTs.
After all, what is a bunch of words with no spaces in between them? Meaningless. What is music (black characters consisting of notes) with no silent spots to differentiate between the notes of music? Chaos. What is a pen and ink drawing without any white space so that what has been drawn may be seen in contrast to it? A mess. In Word you can "see" the spaces if you want ("Tools" "Options" "Formatting Marks" check "Spaces"). That can be programmed into any typing software, MTSO specific or not. So what do they need the VBC for?
Julie, I read your opinion of the AHIMA/MTIA VBC white paper and I agree with what you've said. Subjective and skewed.
14tonks, the position is PT and does not include benefits (although for FT positions they say they have Blue Cross health insurance).
Edited by TJill (05/19/08 08:55 PM)
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TJill
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#98305 - 05/19/08 10:41 PM
Re: VBC pay rate per line
[Re: TJill]
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14tonks
Member
Registered: 10/25/01
Posts: 5931
Loc: Only 3rd world country in US
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The VBC can be used as a way to cut compensation. It is not necessarily used that way. The company you are looking at has adjusted line length appropriately so that there is essentially no difference in pay from counting based on a 65-character-and-space line, so obviously they are not using it for that purpose.
I like VBC myself since I don't have to worry about excess spaces and other invisible characters stuck in to either deliberately pad line counts or just because the transcriptionist doesn't know how to format a document correctly.
As far as paying for all keys hit--virtually no one pays for all keys hit. MTs would be up in arms if anyone did, since the corollary would be that they wouldn't pay for keys not hit, and there would go the productivity and pay gains from expanders.
Any method of counting lines is just a method of estimating how much time and work is in a given document. All the methods ever devised can be used fairly, and they can all be used unfairly. It's much more to the point to figure out if you are being offered fair compensation based on the method used than worrying about what particular estimation method is is use at a given company.
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#98564 - 05/23/08 10:57 AM
Re: VBC pay rate per line
[Re: TJill]
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Jay_Vance_CMT
Member
Registered: 12/08/01
Posts: 1274
Loc: Yuma, AZ
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So what do they need the VBC for?
In my opinion, the point is not that VBC is absolutely without question the best unit of measurement for medical transcription. The point is that the MT industry needs one common unit of measurement, whatever that may be, in order to simplify bidding and billing and help eliminate fraud. Can you imagine what chaos we would have if there were no commonly accepted units of measure such as inches, pounds, etc.? No one is trying to dictate how much per unit to charge or pay, just that we need one commonly accepted unit of measure which will always be the same. A VBC will always be a VBC, no matter how you try to manipulate it. A "line," on the other hand, can be almost anything you want to make it. Using an ephemerous creature like a "line" to bill and pay provides at least two ways to defraud or deceive, if that's your intent: you can manipulate the definition of your unit of measure, and you can manipulate compensation based on that unit of measure. But with a common unit of measure such as the VBC, you've eliminated one of those potential devices of defraudation and deception, which is a good thing in my book.
Any time you change from one system of measurement to another and tie it to compensation, of course there's the potential for fraud or deception or cutting compensation, that's not specific to VBC. If you changed from lines to minutes, you'd have the same potential for fraud, deception, or cutting compensation, but that doesn't mean that using minutes as the unit of measure is ipso facto evidence that someone is trying to cheat. Same goes with VBC.
Determining whether or not someone is using VBC to cut compensation isn't really very complicated. Simply put, are you getting paid less for the same amount of effort? If you are, then the problem is with the RATE per VBC, not the VBC itself. As has already been pointed out in this thread, calculating an equivalent rate for VBC compared to 65-character lines is very easy to do. As long as the rate per VBC results in the same compensation you would have received if you were being paid per line, then where is the problem?
Bottom line, we'll never be able to fairly evaluate competing bids or job offers without a common unit of measurement which everyone uses. Whether it's the VBC or something else, it'll be a tremendous improvement on what we have now. Of course, the whole issue of fair compensation for MTs isn't going to be solved by defining a common unit of measurement. THAT issue won't be solved until MTs are willing to stop working rather than work for substandard compensation.
_________________________
Jay Vance, CMT
aka Papa Jay
Proud Grandparent
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#98565 - 05/23/08 11:37 AM
Re: VBC pay rate per line
[Re: Jay_Vance_CMT]
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tropsicleAfter
Member
Registered: 10/30/06
Posts: 2053
Loc: MS Gulf Coast
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THAT issue won't be solved until MTs are willing to stop working rather than work for substandard compensation.
Jay has perhaps stated better (or at least differently) what I have been saying in other threads. All those that have accepted substandard compensation (for whatever rationalized reason) have contributed as much or more (than any other blame target) to the downward spiral of what money the working MT today can make.
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tropsicle
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#98980 - 05/29/08 02:39 PM
Re: VBC pay rate per line
[Re: Jay_Vance_CMT]
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Julie W8
Member
Registered: 01/10/99
Posts: 3475
Loc: Los Angeles, CA USA
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Jay - I see you bought the hype of the VBC white paper.
There was absolutely nothing wrong with the prior definitions. IMO, the VBC has done nothing but muddy the waters further.
There is no method that cannot be manipulated. If you think there isn't, I have some gorgeous land off the coast of Florida for sale, cheap.
For further reference, please refer to Verifiable Billing.
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#99133 - 05/30/08 06:02 PM
Re: VBC pay rate per line
[Re: Julie W8]
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Jay_Vance_CMT
Member
Registered: 12/08/01
Posts: 1274
Loc: Yuma, AZ
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Julie, we'll have to agree to disagree that there was "absolutely nothing wrong" with existing methods of measurement for transcription. Perhaps the problem lies in semantics. In my mind, a unit of measure should not have to be "defined," or in the case of a "line," re-defined and re-defined and defined again, ad infinitum. When I use terms such as "inch" or "pound," I don't have to clarify what I mean because these are standardized units of measure. Standardized units such as a VBC cannot be "manipulated" in the same sense that the "line" has been manipulated in MT, that's the point I was trying to make. Unscrupulous people can always find ways to cheat, of course, but imagine how much easier it would be to defraud if a foot or a pound could be defined any way the merchant chose.
_________________________
Jay Vance, CMT
aka Papa Jay
Proud Grandparent
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#99166 - 05/31/08 10:26 AM
Re: VBC pay rate per line
[Re: Jay_Vance_CMT]
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Glory1863
Member
Registered: 03/27/08
Posts: 186
Loc: Beyond Antares
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I was struck by how many times "fraud", "deception" and "manipulation" appeared in your original post. It would appear that in terms of trust, the medical transcription industry is right down there with used car salesman. Perhaps the VBC will fix that, but I rather doubt that it will be any time soon if at all. Once a company has lost its good reputation through being proven or even frequently alleged to have been cheating clients and employees alike, it is very hard to rebuild that good reputation. I suspect that no matter how hard the client rep or the recruiter tries to explain how VBC is the "real deal", clients and employees are still going to have in the back of their minds, "Yeah, it looks good, but I'm sure they're playing me; I just haven't figured out how yet." On the employee side particularly, couple this with the wild promises made for VR while cutting pay, and you still have a major credibility problem. On the other hand, companies that have always made it a priority to be honest with their clients and employees by making sure they understood how they were being billed and paid and then delivering as promised, may see no reason to change to VBC. Whatever they use has already been carefully defined to those who matter most, and they've proved their word to be good.
I find your use of "inch" and "pound" as examples to be interesting. Yes, they are carefully defined and well understood in the US and other former English dependencies, but much of the rest of the world uses metric which is also carefully defined and understood.
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The dogmas of the quiet past are inadequate to the stormy present. Abraham Lincoln
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#99195 - 05/31/08 05:33 PM
Re: VBC pay rate per line
[Re: Jay_Vance_CMT]
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TJill
Junior Member
Registered: 04/03/08
Posts: 26
Loc: New York, NY
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In my mind, a unit of measure should not have to be "defined," or in the case of a "line," re-defined and re-defined and defined again, ad infinitum. When I use terms such as "inch" or "pound," I don't have to clarify what I mean because these are standardized units of measure. Standardized units such as a VBC cannot be "manipulated" in the same sense that the "line" has been manipulated in MT, that's the point I was trying to make.
From the ad I originally posted about:
per 55-black-character line
It's not defined as pay "per VBC." It is still clarified as "per line." I suppose pay "per VBC" using the VBC as an UNMODIFIED (or using your terminology, unclarified) UNIT OF MEASURE would translate down into fractions of cents. THAT would be impossible to calculate manually and would be even more complicated, wouldn't it? With computers doing the work though, of course it would not be impossible.
As the ad stated, their VBCs are still defined "per line" just like "characters plus (or without) spaces" is.
In the case I asked about, I got answers that satisfied my curiosity as to how VBC per line stacks up against the measure most often used today.
When I said "why do you need the VBC" I meant it as you can SEE spaces, tabs, etc., if you turn them on in Microsoft Word, so they can be visual characters onscreen also.
I don't think VBC is better or more foolproof than the typical way lines are measured today. That being said, I don't think it is "bad" or "wrong." Just a new idea. MTs need to be aware of how it stacks up against other methods used per line. Now I am aware and I thanked those who answered for their considerable knowledge on the topic.
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TJill
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#99196 - 05/31/08 05:37 PM
Re: VBC pay rate per line
[Re: Glory1863]
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TJill
Junior Member
Registered: 04/03/08
Posts: 26
Loc: New York, NY
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I was struck by how many times "fraud", "deception" and "manipulation" appeared in your original post. It would appear that in terms of trust, the medical transcription industry is right down there with used car salesman. Perhaps the VBC will fix that, but I rather doubt that it will be any time soon if at all. Once a company has lost its good reputation through being proven or even frequently alleged to have been cheating clients and employees alike, it is very hard to rebuild that good reputation.
Somehow I got the feeling from the post you are discussing is that the potential for fraud was on the part of the MT, not the MTSO ... that MTs can add all these invisible characters and get away with it when with the VBC they can't. Kind of in the sense of what 14tonks posted above:
I like VBC myself since I don't have to worry about excess spaces and other invisible characters stuck in to either deliberately pad line counts or just because the transcriptionist doesn't know how to format a document correctly.
Edited by TJill (05/31/08 05:39 PM)
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TJill
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